Have you tried dating a Muslim?
Intercultural dating is a major issue for young Muslims growing up in the West - actually everywhere. To read a conservative position on dating click here. For an interesting discussion on Muslims and dating click here.Watch this rather funny and a bit sad episode of The Little Mosque on the Praire for a sensitive presentation of the issue. The episode is divided in three parts locate the second and third after you finish watching the first part of the episode.
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Islamic dating is a complex combination of religious doctrine and cultural norms. Arranged marriages, strict rules of behavior, family involvement and disdain for any act that is overtly or covertly sexual among muslim men and women are results of these doctrines and norms.
Ibrahim Syed's argument in "Halal Dating" makes it clear that cultures sharing Islamic tradition traditionally used arranged marriages by the parents as a means of observing all religious and cultural duties for chastity. This however causes problems in western countries such as the UK and US, as arranged marriages are clearly forbidden in western societies. The inability to meet un-chaperoned, to eye each other in any way which may be perceived as sexual or even touch results in very difficult problems for young muslim in open societies in which the cultural norms of those societies are far more progressive and free in terms of sexuality and dating behavior.
The episode of Little mosque on the prarie quickly displays the issue of culture clash as a man, presumably christian, attempts social conversation with his Muslim doctor and finds himself stumped when she repeatedly is forced to deny his requests at getting to know her better because of her religious and cultural beliefs. Although Muslim men do not often abide by their beliefs with non-muslim women, it is far more dishonorable for a muslim woman to engage in the same behavior. This inherent inequality is not only unfair but seems almost unthinkable for it to occur in a free society. Western society and Islamic culture in the future will likely continue to find religiously acceptable ways for Muslims to engage in acceptable courtships that are also more in line with the cultural norms of western society.
I found the differences between the conservative article on Islam dating and the more light hearted view presented on "Little Mosque on the Prarie" to be a bit confusing. In the article, the restrictions that are put on young Muslims to be quite intense. From not being able to be alone with another of the opposite sex to the necessity for a young woman to downcast her gaze when in the presence of a man.
I do not really understand how Muslims are supposed to really find a mate that they are totally compatable with when they have to follow such strict guidelines. Muslim women take the unequal brunt of this extremely patriarchal system and have to be way more cautious when engaging in dating and have to follow more rules (downward gaze, covering up with their scarves, etc.). There are some chances for a equality in the marriage, Muslim women can ask for a divorce the same as men, but if a man wants a divorce from his wife he only has to say it three times (why three by the way?).
In regards to "Little Mosque on the Prarie", a beautiful young female Muslim doctor meets a handsome fireman whom she decides to date. Her father and the other males in her life are very opposed to the idea of a good Muslim woman dating an 'infidel'. They go to great lengths to ruin the relationship. At one point, a Muslim man see's her bandaging the young man's hand and starts spreading news of how she is a bad Muslim and a bad example to the community. This view contrasted greatly with the view of her white western mother who was excited for her and wanted her to experience life for herself. I'm not quite sure how her mother and extremely disiplined Muslim father met and how their relationship works, but I felt bad that so much pressure and planing occured behind this woman's back without regard to her thoughts or feelings.
It must be very hard for young Muslims in the west to hold true to the conservative Islamic social stigmas of dating in such an overtly sexualized culture. From a pro-women's equality point of view, I hope that Muslim men appriciate the intelligence, thoughts and feelings of Muslim women and that they have the chance to decide how they want to control their own lives. It is clearly possible to still be a good Muslim and also deviate from out-dated social structures.
I find it very interesting that divorce rates for Muslims are lower than that of Americans in general. To those of us who are encouraged by our families and friends to date around and not “settle for the first thing that comes along,” the concept of marrying a spouse that you have not had time to get to know seems completely alien. However strange it may seem though, perhaps there is something to traditional Muslim “dating.”
As I understand it, the concept of divorce, while not encouraged, is acceptable practice in Islam. In fact, Muslim women were probably among the first females in the world who had the right to ask for a divorce if they were stuck in a union in which either party could not uphold their end of the marriage contract. The Quran says” And if you fear that the two (i.e. husband and wife) may not be able to keep the limits ordered by Allah, there is no blame on either of them if she redeems herself (from the marriage tie) "(2: 229). While I am sure that social norms prohibit this in other countries, it seems to me that in America, unhappy Muslim couples have no more reason to stick it out than do couples of any other religion. However, despite what anyone else expects, many of them do.
In the clips of writing and examples from Halal dating. What is acceptable and what is not is laid out in a easily understandable form. And is basically the same fundamentally though laking in the same intensity as that of "Little Mosque on The Prairie".
Though the basic idea of dating and the morals of Islam that are stressed in the situation of dating are answered. Some where left un-touched. Such as a man and woman are not supposed to look at one another or stare. While all mens and women are supposed to beable to have healthy relationships with each other. Being respectful of the opposite sex. They can be friends but not to close of friends. I think the piece on Muslim relationships in Britain, brings up a good point. That concentrating on behavior rather then on separation. To use your eyes but to turn down your glance. Also making the point that Muslim men and women aren't really getting to know each other. This was a question that I had on a topic that baffled me. How husbands and wives are found? And how long they get to know each other before they are to get married. The article speaks about how marriage "Should be taken seriously as any other major decision in life". This confuses me because it doesn't seem that they could get to know anyone that well with out ever having dated. Simply taking their spouses personality from the opinion of others.
I felt very much the same way about "Little Mosque on The Prairie". The part of he show that stuck out to me the most, was. That while both Muslim men and women aren't supposed to go out and date women seemed to be focused on more for doing so at least in this situation.
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Young Muslims living outside a predominantly Muslim community seem to be experiencing a classic example of a trend sometimes jokingly referred to as “when East meets West”. Young Muslim adults living in the Western world are raised in households in which their parents strive to retain religious and cultural values and norms of their homeland, especially when they are contradictory to the views of the general consensus of the community they are living in, such as the beliefs regarding dating and marriage. However, once their children are of school age, they are thrust into another community that may be entirely different then their household, and these first-generation Muslim Americans are caught at the interception of the two worlds. As depicted in “Little Mosque on the Prairie”, being raised in this situation can create dissonant situations, in which the young Muslim caught in the middle strives to be a part of both societies and cultures, while also serving as a link between them both, who often struggle to understand each other.
There also remains a range of opinions about the issue amongst Muslims; as described in the article by Ibrahim Syed, strict Muslims have specific beliefs about halal dating and relationships between sexes. Long-term implications that may exist are intriguing because of the fact that young Muslims may have an easier time becoming friends with members of the opposite gender who are non-Muslim, versus those who are Muslim, since the non-Muslims may seem to be friendlier as well as more approachable and open, since they have not grown up with the concept that it is inappropriate to have close relations with the opposite sex. This perhaps would lead to further conflict between generations as young Muslims develop friendships that their parents are wary of.
Moderate “compromises” between the beliefs of the two societies are also present, such as the example of the Muslim speed dating, or “matrimonial banquet” discussed in the article by Neil MacFarquhar. Some Muslim parents who recognize that their children may not want arranged marriages, yet still want to have an influence in the process and want their children to meet people of the same religious and cultural backgrounds appreciate this process. This is an interesting arrangement that may serve to be a feasible alternative to traditions of either Western or Middle Eastern cultures for first generation Muslim Americans. Situations such as these may work favorably for parents who want to raise their children with the cultural values that they themselves were raised in, and for young Muslims who have difficulties adjusting to conflicting norms or would like to follow their parents beliefs but find it difficult to do so in the Western societies.
--Ritika Samant
I found the article on halal dating interesting because from the beginning it suggests that sex is a part of dating in Western society. I think that is a misrepresentation of dating. There are many people who, to use the common term, are “saving themselves” for marriage. So dating doesn’t necessarily have to involve premarital sex. The episode of “Little Mosque on the Prairie” gave a good illustration of cultural ignorance on both sides regarding dating. I think that people react negatively when they think of dating from the way it is portrayed on MTV and other outlets for distorted reality. I think for the happiness of both people in the relationship they need to be able to get to know each other before getting married. If the connotations of dating that are associated with it are removed, then I feel there must be some way to date but without compromising one’s religious beliefs.
Lorraine’s commentary on Islamic dating
The video clips (“Little Mosque on the prairie”) and the halal dating articles provided interesting insight into the world of Muslim dating, or rather light courting – and it brought to mind the following thoughts. I would like to mention preemptively that I am no expert in halal dating, whether it is in principle or practice – but I would like to conduct this analysis nonetheless. In my opinion the vigilance with which some Muslims prevent “western” styles of dating among their youth, or the youth among themselves, has something to teach in it’s principle to those who are “people of the book” or “follow the book”. I say this because as a western society, the culture of casual sex, divorce, and single and young parenting (particularly by women) is very prevalent. And in my opinion, I think this has something to do with the manner in which sexual relations among people, perhaps conducted amongst “daters” – albeit some are fleeting dates – have lost some of their consecration or sanctity. And furthermore, in dating especially among the youth in the U.S and especially among women, the pressures are full blown to be sexually active to varying degrees. This is not to say that women do not have their own sexual autonomy, or do not enjoy sex themselves – but as much as women can be strong, women can also be strongly emotional. Even a recent article on MSN, cited that women release a certain hormone after or during sex that triggers some emotional feelings, and that men do not have this same chemical response. In the simplest form, this is why the article stated some men may want to withdraw and sleep after sex; while a woman wonders what she did to offend or disgust her partner. The point I am trying to get across is that, in my opinion (aside for the limited reasons I gave), is that sex, commonly had in western style dating, is something that western culture may sometimes underestimate the power and effects of. It is sex that links two people together; it is through sex that new human beings are produced. Thus, in light of just these two aspects, we see that sex is a special thing – and I think that the halal standards of dating if nothing else help to prevent its abuse or misuse. I would like to also add that I recognize that many (both women and men) who practice western dating styles may practice extra-marital sex in a way that is “respectful” of each person involved, though in the essence of Islam and many other religious ways of life there can be no sanctity outside of marriage. But, I think that halal dating may allow Islamic youth and adults to be blocked from tempting situations, which can prevent them from leading a relationship that is solely sex based, which most definitely can lead to the prevention of all sorts of personal complications such as those listed above.
Why does there have to be distinction of dating between muslims or christians? Dating in both religions is strict and there are forbidden actions, which are the same. If a muslim women dates a non muslim man like in the case of the film, she is considered as a bad muslim and all sort of things are said behind thier back. On the other hand, muslim men are allowed to "date" and yes might be critiziced to some extent. Why is there this discrimination or distrust towards women? Men in Islam have tried to control thier women to the point they dont even trust them or might just see them as a property. Although this is not the case most of the times.
Dating in general if it is seen from any religious background has many rules to follow. It is true that some actions are unmorally uncorrect in a relationship and must be avoided. But not to the extreme that you cannot have friends from the different sex and forbidden to make a friendship with them. How can one make the desicion of getting mariied to someone without knowing that person? For me it is impossible, and as mentioned in the article chosing who one is going to marry is one of the thoufest desision one makes in ones life. Marriage is a gift from GOD and given to us because it is a way we can express our love for that other person who should be our other half. It is good for the family to get invoveld in ones life and accepts the person one chooses, but, to choose who one is going to marry is to much. It is understandable that parents love thier children and want the best for them but not to this level. It is good to hear advise but to a certain limit.
Other than that, how about the cases when a muslim man or women falls in love with a non-muslim, since its prohibited to date or marry someone else ur parents do not choose.What will be the consecuense? Do they even think of that or have that under consideration? Dating is a process where you get to know the person more deeply and see if he/she is your right soulmate. That excludes of course touching to provoce unmarital sex, which is not right under any circumstance no matter what! In conclusion, I personally dont have religious barriers in me and would date anyone even if there is a religious difference. There are always norms to follow and one is who makes the choice.
Before we engage in ethnographic analyses of other cultures, we must first all admit that all of our judgments of different values people have are going to probably be through Western eyes. Even though there is nothing we can do about this, we must be consciousness to remember that Western culture is usually not the standard that the rest of the world judges itself by. Unless we force them to. It would actually be hardly an exaggeration that most of the world probably doesn't care how we judge their values.
Once we bridge that hump of humbleness, we can say...In essence, you can probably count on a lot of things in Islam to sound conservative to modern popular culture perspectives in America. And they most likely will be different. This is for two main reasons. 1- Since the advent of the western definition of modernity and being civilized has equated these things to the secular western model over the 20th century, religion has taken a back seat to rampant materialism and consumerism, therefore any religious philosophies look conservative to most people these days in America and most of the world. If you doubt my “prophecy”, take a look at popular culture here at our University. 2- Mass media and education has indoctrinated the public with a false representation of Islam for strategic political and social reasons. It's the classic oriental story of how the Muslim world is too backward to speak for itself, so we must speak for it. On the other hand, most Muslims in the Muslim world don't really follow their religion or even care, especially in the Arab world, where dictators commodify religion for political power. To make matters even worse, many lay Muslims can't differentiate between their religion and cultures and customs due to immense ignorance. But the ones that take the time to read, understand. So the blame is actually more on the Muslims themselves for putting themselves in this position to begin with. Despite all this, most Sunni Muslims agree on about 70% of Islam including marriage practices, the problem is most people don't do it, so it sends a conflicting message to outsiders wanting to learn more about it. Al hamdullilah, the disease of ignorance is somewhat getting better though. This is exactly why a lot of Western people that convert to Islam, become better Muslims than people that are born Muslim, because they actually take the time to learn the religion and not just blindly follow what their parents taught them.
Regarding the show...Most definitely, oversimplifying an important issue in Islam to a spoof-ish program such as little mosque on the prairie or a random article about dating from a Radiology professor from Kentucky is a disservice. Needless to say, neither are exactly scholarly sources. To reduce an issue to a dichotomy like THE conservative and THE liberal positions we would really be disillusioning ourselves. In any case, the show is entertaining, in a mind-numbing, pitiful sort of way, but by no means educational. It might be more helpful to ask Muslims–knowledgable, practicing ones who have actually read the koran and sunnah--what they believe than reproducing the same stereotypes we can get on every other channel without any critical thought. Other than that, its good for cheap laughs. If anyone wants real information about Islam, I suggest a really practical trip to your local mosque like the one on 28 Salem church rd. in Newark. http://www.isdonline.org/ . Some wonderful scholars are Bilal Phillips, Muhammad Alshareef, Yasir Birjas, and Yasir Qadhi (¾ here in America) or websites like audioislam.com and islamway.com. Also, the 2 biggest organizations here in America, ICNA and ISNA represent average orthodox positions so their websites would be good to visit.
That being said, Arranged Marriages= culture, nothing in Islam that permits forcing someone to marry anyone without the involved parties' consent. Whether the parents have to consent to YOUR choice is a topic of discussion, but its at least preferred, if not obligatory.. Men can only marry “people of the book”, and women only Muslims, Minimal knowledge of Islam affirms this, it has nothing to do with Patriarchal culture, which the whole world is under, but that’s NOT the reason. “lowering the gaze” is prescribed in the Qur'an for men and women. Men and women are ideally not suppose to socialize unless its “necessary”, like school and work colleagues, but there is no “dating” in Islam in the western definition. A man and woman cannot be alone together without someone in the vicinity within eyesight. Of course there is no touching until marriage, but you can talk(obviously not about sex or something like that, modesty is key in Islam so parties should be respectful of each other). and get to know each other. Varying cultures might apply more stringent methods, but this is the average opinion according to Qur'an and Sunnah. Chris's argument that open cultures such as ours are more “progressive” is rather fallacious, because right now America has about a 60% divorce rate and 1 out of 3 women killed in America are killed by their husbands, so....I'm not really sure what we're progressing toward. Whereas, countries with more “traditional” cultures, you can see astonishingly low divorce rates under 10% like Turkey and Macedonia. Things like backbiting(gossiping) behind people's backs is a major sin in Islam which Allah compared to eating the flesh of a dead brother in the Qur'an,and Prophet Muhammad even said that if you did see someone doing something that looks bad, you should “give your brother(or sister of course, most ahadiths are meant for both genders unless specified) 70 excuses” to why it might seem like they're doing something wrong. The “extremist conservative” guy, 'bobor' or what have you, represents the stereotypical uncultured ignorant laymen we have back home in many parts of the Muslim world. Islamically one should give advice in a very caring and almost apologetic way, because the person receiving it is doing them a favor by allowing them to give it. We are suppose to remind each other of our duties to Allah in Islam, with Kindness and Manners in Islam. Something so many of us, including myself sometimes forget.
The show is basically bashing “traditionalist” (really just orthodox) mainstream Islam, and jumping on the bandwagon of creating their own “Western acceptable” Islam that the “modernists” in the West are undertaking. Before we sprain our arms patting ourselves on our backs, lets not forget that less than 150 years ago I could sell my wife for less than $10 in Britain, and my wife couldn't even vote till the 20th century in America. But I won't get into the whole equality debate, in essence, we don't have gender Equality in Islam, we have Gender Equity. We do recognize real differences between men and women, aside from culturally embedded ones. So comparing religion with culture is comparing apples and Beans, what goes on in most Muslim countries today is the farthest we have ever been from our own teachings, but the one good thing that we do still have, unfortunatley, rather hypocritically, is that we believe in them, we just don't do them. ... o yea , Lorraine hit a critical point, that in Islam Allah and his messenger(saws) prohibited the major sins like adultery and fornication, but also the “little” things that lead up to it. That is why prophet Muhammad (saws) prohibited a man and woman to be alone before marriage, and that has nothing to do with culture. Anything respectful that the 2 need to talk about in regard to their potential life together should be able to be discussed within eyesight of other people. If you’re truly sincere about your partner’s marriage potential then that person is more than just a body, you can get to know they’re MIND AND SPIRIT through conversation, and the BODY is in front of you, you don’t need to see all the goods and try them out BEFORE you decide if this person is for you. Then what’s the point of getting married,when you can do everything with everybody?? But I must stress that “dating” in the Western sense of being alone and possible touching is Haraam-impermissable for MALE AND FEMALE. Sexist imposition of many of Allah’s commandments like the disgusting honor killings in some places is due to ignorant men in power, cultural backwardness, and the perfect sign of people that don’t know a thing about Islam, and Allah will punish them severely for their actions inshAllah. Prophet Muhammad said that the best of us is he who is best to his wife, and that heaven is at the feet of our mothers. Allah said in the Koran that men and women will find “comfort” and peace of mind in their marriages together. And prophet Muhammad(saws) recommended that people get married as soon as they are physically, mentally, and financially able to protect against the temptations of life and extreme practices like celibacy. Allah created us, mind, body, and spirit, so we live as Muslims, submitting to what he ordered...Allahu A3lam
You cant possibly think that ALL Muslims in the west are not able to adapt to life in the west ?!?!
if you really do think that than that would be very naïve of you thinking that the 5-8 million population of Muslims in the North America (alone) can not or are not able to adapt to life in the west otherwise how do you think they are living today? And why generations and generations of them are continuing to live where they do live in the West? Obviously than it would have to be the kind of life you are referring to and what in youre view do you think is preventing Muslims from adapting ?
In my opinion I believe that it all depends on the way you are brought up… religion in general is total submission, it is something that should be cherished and respected. whether it be Islam Judaism or Christianity !! people who are and who classify themselves as belonging to any of those religions are aware of the standards and obligations that are expected of them and so therefore it would be hard for anything to lure them or tempt their faith !! HOWEVER, since we are all human beings than the real test really lies on how well you control and pass through those temptations.
The first thing that jumped out at me was the following line: "No premarital sex is allowed in Islam. Thereflore, no dating is allowed on the premise that dating inevitably leads to premarital sex." I really think this statement is flawed. Not all dating leads to premartial sex. Previously it described dating as getting to know each other and then went on to say that dating in North America is described as kissing, roubing, petting, and touching. Without dating how does one choose their partner for the rest of their lives without doing this dating rituals. The piece then goes on to say that marriage to a partner is one of the most important decisons that one can make? I find it very hard to make these decisions base on prayer, family involvment, and careful investigation alone. It is also hard for me to understand how a religon can allow for many wives but not allow premarital sex? The next point Dr. Siddiqui talks about is relations between people outside and inside of school. He states that Muslims should hvae good elations with all people, which is admirable, but it also states that in Islam you should not take a person who is able to be married as a close friend. This really does not make much sense to me to be honest. My opinion and I feel like most peoples opinion would be that their husband or wife would be their closest friend. The next topic of Halal Dating just does not really make much sense to me also. How are marriages supposed to be happy and long lasting when a "broker" chooses your lifetime mate? This blog of mine continues to disagree with Islamic practices. The most prominent reasoning for this would be that I live in a different society with different cultures that are rooted in different histories.
Most of the time as children, our parents throw their religious beliefs on top of us, and all we see is there one-sided view on what to believe and how we should act. They give us their old values and beliefs that they have been taught previously. But as we mature and grow up in a multicultural society in America, we become more liberal. Picking and choosing ideas, values and beliefs that we want from what we see, experience and are taught. But now, dating would work if both individuals were at more liberal levels, religiously. For example, if a Hindu and a Muslim were to date, they would have to be less strict with their religions. If they were the “Strict Muslims” and a Hindu strict with their belief, I would fail to see anything working out because of the differences.
Ibrahim Syed said that dating in North America involves touching, kissing and things eventually lead to premarital sex, I find partly true but not totally true. I do believe that this society is very sexual, but to generalize that relationships in North America lead to premarital sex doesn’t seem correct. There are many people, for religious reasons, moral beliefs and respect for their parents who do not go that far in relationships, but then again there are many who do. And we see this sexual behavior almost everywhere, especially in the media, like television shows and movies.
Arrange marriages are kind of like traditional things in Islamic countries and Indian countries. In North America it is still happening, but here more people feel that they should be able find the one who they will eventually marry. Arrange marriages are getting more interesting because of the use of technology. Now you can go online using dating or matrimonial services like www.shaadi.com to find someone. It still is happening today, however it really depends on whether the bride or bridegroom will agree to actually participate in this and keep traditions going. I know people who are willing to have arranged marriages, but I would never. I would probably rather be single then have my parents choose and basically investigate the one who I am going to be married to. Some people do not find it a big deal and go on with it. Apparently arrange marriages have a low divorce rate in America, but this is probably due to the fear of disappointing the families and because of the pressures of having been arrange married.
Being traditional is something that I believe we all strive to do. If we would like to admit to this or not. We all see a happy promising life in out future with the person we love. This is very traditional. Speed dating is something very new, but holds the same standards. Where the desire to meet someone hopefully to marry is understandable because we all feel that the world around us is getting smaller and moving much faster so we need to find our potential love of our lives right now and there could be no question about it, but lets say if you are a romantic which again I say alot of us are, but won't admit too. That by being a romantic you will know that person who you wish marry most likely the first time you meet them.So don't fight the issue.Don't force something so beautiful happen as fluke because there are no coincidences in life. There is no chance.God is the only one that knows your future, so let him decide when you think you should get married or should meet that Mr. or Ms. right. I am a strong believer if you feel strongly about something then you should act upon it and this includes acting upon a relationship. This is why theres rules in place because sex is something that is going to come eventually. If you can wait and have a relationship then so be it, but if you cannot then you should follow the style that "strict muslims" use to date. Love is the strongest human emotion it makes us do very crazy things. It is only common sense to restrict your mind from certain thoughts and i say again that is why there is right and wrong ways of doing things. To keep that idea of sex away from your life. Something so sacred shouldnt be taken lightly, as we see in the "sex and the city" style of dating. By calling it this it is making fun of a situation where this issue is extremely serious and dangerous, where giving into your desires can lead you down a path of darkeness.
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Fornication is among the greatest sins of Islam and both Allah in the Qur’an and the Sunnah (practice of the Prophet) prescribes severe punishments for the ‘crime’. Muslims do not allow dating because it is considered a premise to premarital sex or ‘Zina’.
Yet today, many Muslims live in western societies where both dating and fornication are widespread and generally accepted. Unlike in Muslim societies it is not viewed as an illegal activity. Dating and premarital sex are ‘OK’, they are considered personal matters and are daily represented directly or indirectly in the Medias.
Hence, it becomes a big challenge for Muslim families living in North America to “save “their children from dating and ensure they preserve their chastity until marriage as recommended by the Qu’ran.
While In Muslim countries parents have the support of their communities in finding partners for their children and organizing arranged marriages this is harder to achieve in America.
One of the solutions American Muslims came up with is “matrimonial Banquets” where young Muslims can get to know each other in a group environment without committing “haram”.
I think this is a perfect illustration of some of the cultural clashes Muslim families living in the West face and ways they find to try to adapt to “modern” societies while conserving their cultural values.
The article on Halal dating brings up quite a few issues. First, I think it is safe to say that premarital sex and promiscuity are assumed to be part of dating in Western culture. Although it is present in some situations, there is plenty of dating that goes on without those two elements and that should be taken into consideration when evaluating the morality of dating in Western culture. Second, the idea that “no dating is allowed on the premise that dating inevitably leads to premarital sex” needs to be addressed. In my opinion, it is quite the stretch to say that dating inevitably leads to premarital sex. If this were true, I could understand the concern about dating. But, I believe that dating encompasses a very important aspect- the opportunity to get to know members of the opposite sex in order to find what features one will want later in a future husband or wife. After all, isn’t it important to find out want you want in a husband or wife before you get married, so the marriage will be successful? In this respect, dating is extremely important.
In regards to the video of “Little Mosque on the Prairie,” I felt it did a very good job of showing the reasoning behind the Muslim rules on dating, along with showing the trouble non-Muslims have understanding those reasons. I think the comedy mixed in with the serious aspects of the episode made it easier for viewers to understand the underlying issues in the episode, which were Muslim rules of dating. By showing the female character’s unease and uncertainty about her dating situation, the episode made it easier to relate to the character and the struggle that some Muslim women face.
Overall, although the so-called “rules” of dating are different in Islam, I think it is important for non-Muslims to educate themselves in order to better understand the Muslim outlook on dating. I feel that shows like “Little Mosque on the Prairie” do a very good job in representing dating in Islam, along with educating non-Muslims on the concerns surrounding dating.
My opinion of Islamic romance is mixed. I find the conservative position of Muslims on dating to be unreasonable. In order to choose someone to spend the rest of one's life with, I think it is important to at least talk to the person alone. Forbidding people to date seems counter-intuitive. Personally, I think that pre-marital relations are not only allowable, but important for the success of the marriage. If it turns out that the two people are physically unattracted to one another, this will undoubtedly cause problems in the marriage.
However, despite my criticisms of the pre-marital constraints of Islam, I admire the fortitude and patience that many Muslims have in marriage. Marriage is taken, as I think it should be, very seriously in Islamic culture. This is part of the reason that I think one should get to know one's spouse as well as possible before marriage. Besides that, I think that the way Muslims try extremely hard to avoid divorce is fantastic. This is especially important when the couple has children. I find that other cultures take marriage and divorce much too lightly, leading to broken families and children without proper upbringings. If Americans treated marriage with proper care and caution, the nation would be much better off.
Not to pick on Mohammed, but where in the world did you get those statistics on murder and divorce from?
That's not even the point.
You cannot assert that a traditionalist interpretation of Halal dating accounts for the low rates of divorce in Islamic states. It's a logical fallacy so great, that I struggle to believe you’re even trying to have an open discussion.
Those countries are also known for husbands refusing to divorce their wives and instead taking new wives as replacements. In less extreme cases, these are societies in which 1) women cannot request divorce, and therefore do not bring it up and 2) divorce is severely frowned upon.
With all due respect, when citing statistics, I ask that you please not take me to be an idiot. You’ve said several times that honesty is necessary to debate Islam, and this is one of several cases in which you are clearly not willing to engage in an open discussion. Divorce rates would be much, much higher if women could initiate the process and if the incredible number of social and political barriers were removed.
I’m sure you’ll find it interesting to note that incidents of spousal battery are significantly higher in these countries than in the United States, especially in India where acid attacks have become somewhat of a national sport.
Please (and I mean this with no disrespect ... seriously) don't insult my intelligence.
Coming from a Western point of view, the idea of dating is a normality, without it i believe I would be lost. Although the idea of have an arraigned marriage seems so foreign to me, to the Muslim world it is a normality and I respect it. It seems though that the muslim faith is much more strict there way of life may be much more simple. The implementation of family in the process seems to allow for a higher success rate. With a glimpse of your partners family you can understand where an individual comes from and you can see if you are both compatible. The norms of Muslim "dating" seemes to keep things more in line. The episode of Little Mosque on the prarie was a shining example of how religious culture is so different and how it can make certain situations difficult. Although the idea of courting someone is foreign in the Muslim world but seems to be moving in the right direction. Although it seems as if dating might be extremly difficult in the Muslim world and that the hard restraints put on by religious views might leave muslims yearing for more with others prior to marriage. The worst aspect might be that in the middle east the customs are a norm but in the west we do not practice these ideas in any way. Dating is such a big part of life that it must make it difficult for muslim americans. One can only hope that they are able to adapt and are successful in the social realm.
Who’s to say whether your love life with your spouse would be better if you had sex with them before you got married, or afterwards? Can anyone speak with authority on this topic? In other words, does anyone have a sexual time machine that allows you to remember how both scenarios played out?
So, please, if we could all get off our relationship high horses and recognize that we really couldn’t possibly understand the other side of sexual activity, that would be lovely.
Muslims wait because they believe all the lines are much clearer – marriage, sex, babies, family, heaven. Voila. If sexual relations and love don’t necessarily mean marriage and spending a lifetime together, and babies don’t mean parenting and starting a family, not only is life here confusing, but heaven is problematic too.
Waiting to have sex is harder the more you know someone and touch them and spend time with them on your bed and you know where I’m going. So, Muslims circumvent this dilemma by doing all that stuff after marriage.
What if you wait and marry the wrong person and have to start over, this time not a virgin, and with terrible first experiences of sex? What if you don’t wait and fall in love but separate and live the rest of your life comparing people to someone gone? What if you don’t wait but are monogamous with that person your whole life? What if you wait and never get married?
Can I say which way works better? No, because like everyone else in the world, I haven’t tried both. But since I talk to men every day, and maybe in rooms alone, it makes sense for me to also talk to the man I will marry, and know him more intimately and confide in him more than the rest.
Fornication is not only forbidden in Islam, but also in Judaism in Christianity. The difference with the Western societies and Islamic countries is that the West has accepted these sins; and to a certain extent makes it a norm. In the West, Sex is everywhere it is promoted through movies and media. Muslims do not allow dating not only because it may lead to pre marital sex but also because Islam promotes modesty. There is a cultural clash with Muslims living in America, because everything that they have been taught contrasts with their surroundings. While living in a Islamic country it is much easier to adhere to the religion. In the episode of Little Mosque on the Prairie, it shows a good example of the clash of cultures. Rayyan deals with a struggle because she does not want to go against Islam and date, but eventually does. As is noticed, that she could not be with her date by herself… this is totally prohibited in Islam before marriage. It is said when there is a man and a woman alone the third person is the devil. I understand this rationale. I understood her situation because being a Muslim woman, I have dealt with the same thing. A little difference is that most Muslim families would not agree to an American Christian marrying their daughter, let alone date them.
I found these articles to interesting, dating and marriage are very complex issues when there are rules of behavior being enforced by religion and a household. In 21st century America it is difficult for Muslim young adults to conform to these restrictions because of the pressures of society and the desire to fit in with American society. It’s a difficult situation to place restrictions on young adults in America that dictate who they can have a relationship with and what they can do. In the Western world pre-marital sex is a lot more common and has become acceptable. The Muslim word seeks to promote these things as being sacred and forbidden. I agree with making an attempt to preserve this and in the Western world many other religions take these sins lightly and it has become a norm to commit these sins.
I found this information to be very eye opening. I did not know how strictly Islamic dating was governed. Alot of responsibility is placed on the woman in this, not relationship relationship; because dating leads to premarital sex. Why, in such a male dominated society and marriage relationship are women held in such responsibility? There is no equality in these marriages, why should such overbearing practices be enforced on someone who has little to no rights? It seems as if its a contemporary form of slavery.
I do believe that Muslims should abide by the laws that the Qur'an hasset in place. I do not even disagree with their punishments. I do however disagree with the distribution of power in marriage and society. All to much is held against women for the little that they have control over.
The Little Mosque on the Prarie link was removed from youtube.
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